His mother handed him a cherished family dagger and told roguelike reddit to commit suicide in case he was captured. Onoda was sent to Lubang Island in the Philippines in December Allied forces took the island only a couple months later, but Onoda was trained in guerilla warfare and was able to hide in the mountains while also launching attacks of his own.
Onoda found a leaflet in October claiming that Japan had surrendered in August. But of course he knew that was propaganda. Japan surrender? Another set of leaflets came later that year that claimed to be from a Japanese general. More propaganda. Letters purporting to be from family members arrived in Fake letters of course.
In Norio Suzuki, a young Japanese adventurer, tracked down and befriended Onoda, but he still refused to believe the war was over. And on this subreddit, a war rages constantly. A war of words. Step 1: A fan of roguelite games e.
A round of congratulatory high fives are had. Step 5: A flamewar erupts. Every confused comment from the OP makes things worse and they are downvoted into oblivion true story: I was once downvoted for simply asking for a link in one of these discussions. They are screamed at, called names, told to leave, and they usually do. The above scenario has been happening for YEARS and the reason it keeps happening is because the gaming world at large has no idea that there is a difference between a roguelike and a roguelite.
These flamewars that try to settle the issue definitively simply do roguelike reddit reach a wider audience because, of course, roguelite games are orders of magnitude more popular than traditional roguelikes I would guess at least 50 times more popular based on active player counts and sales data of respective games.
Can we just… stop? Much like the 50th person in a reply-all fiasco replying all to beg everyone to stop replying all, I have to shoulder some responsibility here. Talking down to people that have a limited understanding of these truly obscure issues is pedantic and it reeks of snobbery.
At this point, you probably hate my guts. I will grant you quite a few things. You might argue longer, but the genre had no name between and Between andbasically everyone could agree what it meant. And it was clueless gamers, lazy streamers, and unscrupulous developers that contributed to the dilution of the word. Full stop. You will of course argue about the origin of the word and link me to a certain interpretation of what the word meant in You will say: the word has not changed.
It cannot change. Words changing? Why should we have to change? We were here first! It should be plainly evident that language evolves. Even our most common words have changed meanings. Awful, silly, nice, fantastic, terrible. These words all have had drastically different meanings over time. Spelunky changed everything. Things have only gotten worse every year since then. Roguelite is less obviously terrible, but still bad.
As far as I can tell it was invented by the Rogue Legacy developers. Other terms like Procedural Death Labyrinth as clever as they are never got close to taking off. The path of least resistance was to use the least bad option; thus the definition of roguelike was expanded. Why are we roguelike reddit all the evidence to the contrary, like Hiroo Onoda did? At least Onoda had a good reason to keep fighting. He was roguelike reddit and trained his entire life to never surrender no matter the circumstances.
After all, he was fighting for a living god. The proper way forward is to admit reality and distinguish traditional roguelikes in a different way, just like that in fact. Traditional roguelike. Now, I have long thought the roguelikes subreddit should allow roguelite discussion. If for no other reason than we are using an archaic meaning of a word and then naming our community based on that word. I realize this is a minority opinion among the most vocal posters, despite the subreddit description itself allowing such discussion. Censoring roguelite discussion prevents a lot of people from finding amazing games and it also le to a stagnation of the genre.
These games, love em or hate em, share a lot in common with traditional roguelikes. The developers have to figure out ways to make permadeath interesting, to make procedural generation less boring, to innovate on all manner of mechanics. And many have succeeded! This is terrible from a de point of view, as it limits creative potential.
We should be studying the relic system of Slay the Spire. Or the magic system of Noita. One of the most common requests in the community is for a roguelike with an interesting spell system. Well here you go. It fuses two of my favorite genres physics games and roguelikes taking the best elements of both. Even if you think the community should stick to discussing traditional roguelikes, we still need to be more welcoming to clueless outsiders.
Those outsiders might not know the first thing about say Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup, but it might turn out to be their favorite game if they were properly introduced to it. Not all roguelite players will cross over, but many will. They all like permadeath, procedural generation, sometimes even turn based games. We need them more than they need us. The roguelike reddit people that we laugh at and kick out and call trolls today might be our best bet of saving the community tomorrow. We might do well to remember that the word roguelike is an accident of history, as are all words.
A fair argument. My main thing is when people slam some poor asshole who honestly has no idea what a traditional roguelike even is, due to Steam mis-tagging and the like. Like you said, one of these guys could grow up and make a true roguelike the world has never seen one day. I am also a year veteran middle school English teacher.
The “roguelike” war is over
Bravo on this post! It perfectly captures my thoughts on the whole argument here on terminology. Words are only useful in so much as they help us to communicate about other things that actually matter. Namely here, the games themselves. Once the argument becomes more about semantics than about the actual things themselves, the argument is now about arguing instead of moving forward.
Thank you so much for the feedback! Good luck with your game. Would love to hear about it in the future.
One thing perhaps worth noting, is that even purist definitions have of course evolved. It is not over. He got several things wrong, like the idea that rogue legacy coined the term roguelite. We have google search trend metrics to back up the fact that the term roguelite entered existence either in or prior torogue legacy entered existence around ish. B those that stubbornly refuse to use correct verbiage seem larger in simply by virtue of riding the coat-tails of the uninformed masses C one cannot claim that a victor has been announced so soon when the debate matter has only so recently been brought into the roguelike reddit eye.
D less and less people are actually misusing the term roguelike.